Using Stories to Bring Families Together with Abby Engel and Pet Angel Adoption

Abby loves story. So much so that she now uses stories across all of Pet Angel Adoptions’ social media platforms. The goals: find the perfect forever home for the cats in their no-kill shelter. And the innovation doesn’t stop there. Because another goal is to make sure that the cats don’t come back to the rescue.

Pet Angel Adoption is a no-kill cat rescue located in Frankenmuth, Michigan.

Connect with Pet Angel Adoption: https://petangeladoption.com/

Get these amazing interviews sent directly to your inbox: https://totalmichigan.com/join

Transcript
Abby Engel:

I don't know if I'm fearless because I do think the hate is pretty

Abby Engel:

hard sometimes and I do privately take it pretty hard, but, I still show up

Abby Engel:

because it's my job because no one else is gonna do it for the cats.

Cliff Duvernois:

Hello everyone and welcome back to another episode of

Cliff Duvernois:

Ordinary People, extraordinary Things.

Cliff Duvernois:

I'm your host, cliff Dubin, wa.

Cliff Duvernois:

You know, when it comes to the world of nonprofits, I love to find those out there

Cliff Duvernois:

who are doing things differently, and that is certainly the case with today's guest.

Cliff Duvernois:

She's taken this small local cat rescue.

Cliff Duvernois:

And connected it with a large base of raving fans from all across the globe.

Cliff Duvernois:

Please welcome to the show, the animated Abby Engel from Pet Angel Adoption.

Cliff Duvernois:

out of Frankenmuth, Michigan.

Cliff Duvernois:

Abby, how are.

Cliff Duvernois:

you

Cliff Duvernois:

You

Abby Engel:

I'm good cliff.

Abby Engel:

How are you?

Cliff Duvernois:

I'm doing awesome.

Cliff Duvernois:

Thank you for asking.

Cliff Duvernois:

And I know that Abby Engel isn't gonna be your name for long, cuz

Cliff Duvernois:

you just got recently engaged.

Abby Engel:

did.

Abby Engel:

By the end of this year, I'll be Abby Krieger.

Abby Engel:

Thank you.

Abby Engel:

I'm so excited.

Cliff Duvernois:

there we go.

Cliff Duvernois:

So we're talking today about Pet Angel Adoption.

Cliff Duvernois:

Why don't you walk us through what Pet Angel adoption is?

Abby Engel:

So for 20 years my parents have been running a cat

Abby Engel:

rescue and they accidentally started it, um, when I was eight.

Abby Engel:

My.

Abby Engel:

Parents had some feral cats in our backyard and they had given

Abby Engel:

birth and abandoned the kittens.

Abby Engel:

And my mom had bottle fed kittens before, so she was like, let's just do this.

Abby Engel:

We can take 'em in bottle, feed 'em, find 'em homes, we'll be done with it.

Abby Engel:

So of course we took 'em to the local vet to get them vetted because that's what you

Abby Engel:

do when you bottle feed kittens everybody.

Abby Engel:

And.

Abby Engel:

They were like, why do you have so many kittens?

Abby Engel:

And my mom explained the whole situation and then the next thing

Abby Engel:

she knows, they were like, well, hey, this person found a cat.

Abby Engel:

Will you take it?

Abby Engel:

And this person found a cat, will you take it?

Abby Engel:

And before we knew it, we had cages of cats in my childhood garage

Abby Engel:

and my parents said, we can't keep cats in our garage like this.

Abby Engel:

So they had a decision to make, which was in one hand, just find all the cats.

Abby Engel:

We currently had homes and.

Abby Engel:

Call it good and get rid of the cages and be done, or file for a

Abby Engel:

non-profit PA paperwork and find a location, and they went with the

Abby Engel:

ladder and petting Angel was born.

Abby Engel:

We

Cliff Duvernois:

so why did they, so let me ask you this question.

Cliff Duvernois:

Why go that route?

Cliff Duvernois:

Why not just get rid of the cats and say we're out of this business

Cliff Duvernois:

versus going into a nonprofit?

Cliff Duvernois:

Cuz having a nonprofit is tough.

Abby Engel:

I think that's a question you'd have to ask my mom, but if I

Abby Engel:

was to answer for her, I would say it's because they're good people.

Abby Engel:

There you go.

Abby Engel:

I don't think my parents could.

Abby Engel:

look

Abby Engel:

at all of these homeless cats and kittens and be like, forget you.

Abby Engel:

So I truly think that I, I always say to people that I was born to my parents

Abby Engel:

because this is what I was supposed to do.

Abby Engel:

I mean, God, whatever higher power could have put me with any people.

Abby Engel:

And he put me with the two people who started an animal rescue and

Abby Engel:

then he like, Poured into me all this compassion and empathy and I'm just

Abby Engel:

like, this is where I'm supposed to be.

Abby Engel:

And I think that that also plays a part into like who my mom is.

Abby Engel:

I mean, cliff didn't mention it, but Cliff also knows my parents very well.

Abby Engel:

Cliff was my dad's brother's best friend when they were kids.

Abby Engel:

So Cliff knows my dad.

Abby Engel:

He knew my parents' probably before I was even around.

Abby Engel:

And so he knows who they are and I don't think my parents could

Abby Engel:

just not, they love animals.

Abby Engel:

My mom specifically,

Abby Engel:

As a child, my brother Alex, he's three years younger than I, instead

Abby Engel:

of going home after school, we went to the cat rescue because my

Abby Engel:

mom was taking care of it alone.

Abby Engel:

That was her full-time job.

Abby Engel:

She didn't, she was a stay-at-home mom.

Abby Engel:

Al my, my dad worked so.

Abby Engel:

Stay-at-home.

Abby Engel:

Mom became cat rescue and stay-at-home mom.

Abby Engel:

So when she would pick us up from school, we went, we went

Abby Engel:

to the rescue instead of home.

Abby Engel:

So the cat rescue became our playground.

Abby Engel:

I remember as a kid we would keep our snow gear at the rescue, like

Abby Engel:

our snow pants and our jackets, and our gloves, and our hats.

Abby Engel:

And after school, Alex and I would put it all on and the landlord

Abby Engel:

outside the rescue would push all the snow in the parking lot.

Abby Engel:

The sides of the parking lot and we would dig tunnels and we

Abby Engel:

would play in the snow for hours.

Abby Engel:

While my mom's meeting with adopters and cleaning cages and doing paperwork

Abby Engel:

and all the cat rescue things that you need to do, we would keep our little

Abby Engel:

like razor scooters at the rescue and like play on the parking lot.

Abby Engel:

So like my childhood memories.

Abby Engel:

Are of the cat rescue.

Abby Engel:

We now have like free room apartment rooms, but before that it was dog runs

Abby Engel:

that we used as the free room rooms.

Abby Engel:

And one dog run was quote unquote mine and one was Alex's.

Abby Engel:

And we would just.

Abby Engel:

Spend time in these runs and we would pretend they're our offices.

Abby Engel:

And when adopters would come in, I'd try to convince them to adopt

Abby Engel:

a cat from my quote unquote run.

Abby Engel:

And Alex would try to convince him to adopt cats from his run.

Abby Engel:

And so that was like my introduction to cat adoption.

Abby Engel:

When I got older, I got a lot of volunteer hours because I was volunteering at

Abby Engel:

a cat rescue every day of my life.

Abby Engel:

So I was lucky to get some scholarships and get recognized for volunteer hours.

Abby Engel:

And then when I graduated, . I didn't really know what I

Abby Engel:

wanted to do with my life.

Abby Engel:

I got a degree in communications, which I loved.

Abby Engel:

My minor is in P T W, which is professional technical writing.

Abby Engel:

I love to write, which I think reflects in my cat biographies

Abby Engel:

that I write now at my job, but,

Abby Engel:rian Princess here in town in:Abby Engel:

So I needed all of the weekends off in the summer to tour as Princess because

Abby Engel:

I had to go and be in parades and represent Frankenmuth, and I couldn't

Abby Engel:

find a job straight out of graduation that would give me the time off.

Abby Engel:

But my mom needed a rescue worker and I needed a job.

Abby Engel:

So the agreement was for my Princess Ray and I would work at Pet Angel

Abby Engel:

and then I'd find another job after I gave up my crown at the end of,

Abby Engel:in:Abby Engel:

still.

Abby Engel:

. I'm not leaving until the rescue leaves

Cliff Duvernois:

with regards to the rescue, it's not just a simple

Cliff Duvernois:

process of people walking through the door and picking out a cat.

Cliff Duvernois:

There's, you know, application that they've gotta fill out everything.

Cliff Duvernois:

Walk us through that

Cliff Duvernois:

process.

Abby Engel:

Well, actually, I think this is gonna be the

Abby Engel:

first place I talk about this.

Abby Engel:

I've come up with a new way to describe Pet Angel.

Abby Engel:

We're not just like any other animal shelter where you can go in, you can meet

Abby Engel:

all of the cats that we have available and pick whichever one you want because,

Abby Engel:

That's not realistically how picking an animal works, and I don't think

Abby Engel:

that everybody really realizes that you need the perfect match

Abby Engel:

for your family, and every cat needs the perfect match for them.

Abby Engel:

So that's what we do.

Abby Engel:

We help you find your perfect match.

Abby Engel:

Instead of just finding a cat, I take into account your other pets, how

Abby Engel:

active your home is, how many people you have in your home, what your

Abby Engel:

home is like, and what you want in.

Abby Engel:

to be able to find the perfect cat for you.

Abby Engel:

So if you have, let's say it's just you, just, you Cliff, you

Abby Engel:

don't want to have any other pets.

Abby Engel:

It's just you.

Abby Engel:

You don't plan on having anybody else in your household for the

Abby Engel:

next 10 years, and you want.

Abby Engel:

, an active, playful cat that'll just interact with you.

Abby Engel:

But like you know, you will go interview people all the time.

Abby Engel:

So someone who can be independent while you're off doing interviews for

Abby Engel:

your podcast, I'd be able to find you a cat that would love to cuddle and

Abby Engel:

greet you at the door, but is also gonna be good solo when you're gone.

Abby Engel:

They're not gonna like climb your curtains or destroy things.

Abby Engel:

But I feel like sometimes when people go into an animal rescue, they see

Abby Engel:

that super cute cat in the cage.

Abby Engel:

They don't ask oh, what's his personality like?

Abby Engel:

Does he like kids?

Abby Engel:

Does he like other cats?

Abby Engel:

Does he climb curtains?

Abby Engel:

What's his history?

Abby Engel:

Know that and you don't know that, so you just kinda get thrown in with a

Abby Engel:

cat you know nothing about, and then you have to try to figure it out.

Abby Engel:

And that's why I don't think adoptions last all the time.

Abby Engel:

So we've altered the way that I do my adoptions.

Abby Engel:

So let's say you're a family of five coming in to meet cats.

Abby Engel:

If I have a cat who doesn't like children, I'm not gonna show you

Abby Engel:

those cats, which I think makes sense.

Abby Engel:

Now I'm

Abby Engel:

not trying to talk shade on other rescues here, but I don't feel

Abby Engel:

like other rescues really always take that into consideration.

Cliff Duvernois:

Well, I think there's just a a marked difference

Cliff Duvernois:

too between people that are just thinking, get the cats outta.

Abby Engel:

Mm-hmm.

Cliff Duvernois:

without really thinking about the fact that that

Cliff Duvernois:

people could take the cat home, like you were talking about before.

Cliff Duvernois:

So people look at a cat, they think it's cute, they take it home, but the

Cliff Duvernois:

cat wants to have nothing to do with

Cliff Duvernois:

the kids.

Cliff Duvernois:

Yeah.

Cliff Duvernois:

So the kids are crying cuz the cat doesn't wanna play with me.

Cliff Duvernois:

The cat's always mean.

Cliff Duvernois:

So what do they do?

Cliff Duvernois:

They bring the cat

Cliff Duvernois:

back Exactly

Cliff Duvernois:

right.

Cliff Duvernois:

And want to exchange it for another cute one that's in there.

Cliff Duvernois:

So with that being.

Cliff Duvernois:

How do you go about judging the, I guess, quote unquote personalities of the cats

Cliff Duvernois:

to determined, well, this one likes kids.

Cliff Duvernois:

Oh, this one likes to be by itself.

Cliff Duvernois:

This one needs another cat for companionship.

Cliff Duvernois:

How do you go about

Cliff Duvernois:

judging that?

Abby Engel:

Sometimes it's easy because the cat will be surrendered

Abby Engel:

to me with that information.

Abby Engel:

For example, I have a cat right now who was surrendered because she did not get

Abby Engel:

along with children in the home, so that's why the family couldn't keep her anymore.

Abby Engel:

So it's obvious to me she's not gonna do well in a home with children again.

Abby Engel:

But I also have volunteers who are my lovely quote unquote Guinea pigs, and.

Abby Engel:

I can ask them, Hey, when you came in with your six-year-old

Abby Engel:

last week, how did Sonny do?

Abby Engel:

And they can let me know.

Abby Engel:

Like Sonny doesn't really interact with my six year old when we're at the,

Abby Engel:

when we're volunteering, or this one hides whenever he comes into the room.

Abby Engel:

So I can figure that out by process of illumination with my volunteers.

Abby Engel:

It is hard with dogs because I can't bring a dog into my animal rescue because they.

Abby Engel:

Our animal, and we can't just let animals that aren't fully quarantined interact

Abby Engel:

with our animals for, illness reasons.

Abby Engel:

So for that, I just base it off of personality.

Abby Engel:

If they're really, really scared when I walk in the room.

Abby Engel:

If a Great Dane walks in the room, they're probably also gonna be really scared.

Abby Engel:

If a cat is so shy that like you, they don't come out very often unless they

Abby Engel:

eat, drink, or go to the bathroom, they're probably not gonna be comfortable to

Abby Engel:

come out to interact around at any dog.

Abby Engel:

I have a small dog at home, so sometimes I'll use could

Abby Engel:

this cat handle my dog doodle?

Abby Engel:

Doodle is not very big.

Abby Engel:

If they could handle doodle, I feel like they could handle any

Abby Engel:

dog

Abby Engel:

, right?

Abby Engel:

So I kind of sometimes take that into consideration too.

Abby Engel:

But sometimes it's just easy to tell when you interact with the cat.

Abby Engel:

I have one right now.

Abby Engel:

He's a face biter.

Abby Engel:

He's not being mean.

Abby Engel:

He just likes to nibble on your face.

Abby Engel:

But obviously I'm not gonna give a family with a newborn

Abby Engel:

baby a cat that bites faces.

Cliff Duvernois:

No, you

Cliff Duvernois:

definitely would

Abby Engel:

wanna do

Abby Engel:

that.

Abby Engel:

Some people might though, so I always make sure people know like,

Abby Engel:

I don't want you to just find a cat.

Abby Engel:

I want you to find your perfect match.

Abby Engel:

Cuz like you said, I don't think it's fair for a kid to have a cat

Abby Engel:

that hates them and I don't think it's fair to a cat to have a home.

Abby Engel:

where they hate someone in the home.

Abby Engel:

So I'd rather find that cat home where they like everybody and find you a,

Abby Engel:

a cat that would love your kids and wanna sleep in bed with your kids.

Abby Engel:

I have cats that'll do that.

Abby Engel:

It's just whether or not you like the looks of them, I guess.

Cliff Duvernois:

So now what is your track record as far as

Cliff Duvernois:

placing cats inside of homes?

Cliff Duvernois:

I mean, I don't know if you know exact numbers off the top of your head,

Cliff Duvernois:

but I mean, is it like really good?

Cliff Duvernois:

Do you see a lot of people bringing their cats back when they're done?

Abby Engel:

So when I took over Pet Angel, I did, I do feel like I

Abby Engel:

helped change the way that we did adoptions because I saw a lot of

Abby Engel:

returns when I first started full-time.

Abby Engel:

And one of the things I wanted to do was, Stop returns.

Abby Engel:

I wanted to make sure when a cat go goes home, they're going home to

Abby Engel:

their forever home unless for like a dire emergency, like an owner

Abby Engel:

passes away or something like that.

Abby Engel:

And so I did think that that cut back on adoptions a little bit, but it

Abby Engel:

also cut back on our return rate which I consider if a cat is adopted and

Abby Engel:

returned three weeks later, that's not a true adoption number in my opinion.

Abby Engel:

They were returned, so I don't count that as an adoption of the year.

Abby Engel:

But the pandemic really did play a really big part into our adoption

Abby Engel:

numbers, and it still is today.

Abby Engel:

So I didn't really talk about how many adoptions we did last

Abby Engel:

year because it was very low.

Abby Engel:

And that's because a lot of people, when they went into the

Abby Engel:

pandemic and had all this time off.

Abby Engel:

They wanted adopted animals and then when they all went

Abby Engel:back to work in:Abby Engel:

They all return to the animals, to the shelters.

Abby Engel:

So right now the shelters are in a bit of an epidemic ourselves, and I

Abby Engel:

don't know if a lot of people know that we are, but we're overcrowded.

Abby Engel:

We don't have adoptions.

Abby Engel:

We just have more people wanting to bring us cats.

Abby Engel:

And we're also now a no-kill state, which means 90% of the animals going

Abby Engel:

into kill shelters are not euthanized.

Abby Engel:

I'm a no-kill shelter, so that statistic doesn't matter for me.

Abby Engel:

But for the state of Michigan, that just means that we eliminated.

Abby Engel:

Eliminating of animals, which is great.

Abby Engel:

That's what we wanna do.

Abby Engel:

We don't wanna euthanize them.

Abby Engel:

But we also didn't come up with what we're gonna do with the

Abby Engel:

surplus of animals that we now have.

Abby Engel:

So all of our animal rescues are

Abby Engel:

full.

Abby Engel:

Everybody wants to keep bringing us more, which is contributing

Abby Engel:

to the dumping of animals now.

Abby Engel:

So it's all just bleeding over and is a little crazy right now.

Abby Engel:

I do think that's also playing into what I'm calling the epidemic of rudeness.

Abby Engel:

The animal welfare world because so many people have animals they

Abby Engel:

wanna return, but we're all full.

Abby Engel:

So people are getting upset and acting out towards us in the animal welfare industry.

Abby Engel:

And a lot of people I know from other shelters in the state are actually

Abby Engel:

leaving the industry because it's too emotionally tolling for them right now.

Cliff Duvernois:

Sweet Moses.

Cliff Duvernois:

Yeah.

Cliff Duvernois:

There's a whole other component right there.

Cliff Duvernois:

What I'd like to do is I would like to, cuz you were talking before about

Cliff Duvernois:

the personality that your cats have.

Cliff Duvernois:

Yeah.

Cliff Duvernois:

So what I'd like to do is I want to talk to you about how you

Cliff Duvernois:

are leveraging social media.

Cliff Duvernois:

To get your message out and to connect with your audience.

Cliff Duvernois:

Cuz one of the things that you do really well on Facebook,

Cliff Duvernois:

I read your post whenever you've got, you know, hi, my name is Timmy.

Cliff Duvernois:

Yes,

Cliff Duvernois:

and there's some post about, oh, well I like kids and I like to snuggle.

Cliff Duvernois:

And you really do an excellent job of painting a personality around a cat.

Cliff Duvernois:

Not only to, you know, let people know that, hey, there's, there's

Cliff Duvernois:

this, really cute cat here.

Cliff Duvernois:

But also get the message out to people that if they are looking for a cat, here's

Cliff Duvernois:

one that might be a good fit for you.

Cliff Duvernois:

First off, how did you come up with the idea to start giving your, your

Cliff Duvernois:

cats these, I guess, backs, stories

Cliff Duvernois:

on

Cliff Duvernois:

social.

Abby Engel:

I call

Abby Engel:

' em resumes.

Abby Engel:

So the idea was, I don't know if you've seen the little like documents I make

Abby Engel:

where it actually looks like a job resume, but every cat at the rescue gets a true

Abby Engel:

quote unquote job resume made for them that I handmake and takes a really long

Abby Engel:

time , but I do it and it's a resume for them to be your new house cat.

Abby Engel:

Um, I came up with it because, . I went to school.

Abby Engel:

Well, my minor is professional technical writing, like I said.

Abby Engel:

And one of the things that we did in that was make resumes, and that was my favorite

Abby Engel:

part of Ptw when I was in college.

Abby Engel:

I love making resumes.

Abby Engel:

All of my friends, like ask me to help them make their resumes because

Abby Engel:

it's like a secret love of mine.

Abby Engel:

So I'm like, heck yeah.

Abby Engel:

I wanna make resumes all, all the time.

Abby Engel:

I love doing this, so I'm gonna make 'em for the cats

Abby Engel:

and

Abby Engel:

I.

Abby Engel:

Personalize it and make it all cute, which is what I love to do, but I also

Abby Engel:

get to do it about an animal that I love.

Abby Engel:

I don't think a lot of people know how long an animal is with us before

Abby Engel:

they go up for adoption, but all the animals have to be quarantined

Abby Engel:

for at least 10 days before they can even be considered or moved.

Abby Engel:

And I don't put them up for adoption.

Abby Engel:

Oh, 10 days is up.

Abby Engel:

They're up for adoption.

Abby Engel:

I move them out of our isolation room at that point, and I wait until

Abby Engel:

they're comfortable in their new environment, whether that's a cage or

Abby Engel:

free room, room, something like that, before I put them up for adoption.

Abby Engel:

So I usually know them for at least a month

Abby Engel:

before.

Abby Engel:

And in that month I'm interacting with them from the state of, they're absolutely

Abby Engel:

terrified, hissing, growling, hiding when they arrive to their crawling all

Abby Engel:

over my lap and cuddling on day 30.

Abby Engel:

So I get to know their personality a lot.

Abby Engel:

I know their backstory cuz I'm the one that took them in.

Abby Engel:

So I can tell you where they came from.

Abby Engel:

I can tell you why they were surrendered.

Abby Engel:

I know their personality because I've been the one that's working

Abby Engel:

with them every day on socializing.

Abby Engel:

And I can.

Abby Engel:

them, interact with the other cats.

Abby Engel:

Oh my gosh.

Abby Engel:

They love the other cats.

Abby Engel:

Okay.

Abby Engel:

They'll do great in a home with other cats.

Abby Engel:

You mentioned I do have some pairs.

Abby Engel:

It's very obvious which ones don't want to leave each other.

Abby Engel:

So when you see that happen, I can say like, okay, these

Abby Engel:

guys need to be a bonded pair.

Abby Engel:

They won't even, I can't take this one out of the room without the

Abby Engel:

other ones screaming their head off.

Abby Engel:

They need to be together.

Abby Engel:

I think it's just like, you know, when you know a lot of people, it's kinda like

Abby Engel:

asking a teacher, like how they make their c lassroom seating chart, they kind of

Abby Engel:

get to know the students and know, okay, these two can't sit next to each other.

Abby Engel:

I know which two cats cannot be in the same room together, . But

Abby Engel:

I also think that that helps a lot with placing em into their homes.

Cliff Duvernois:

The added aspect to this as well, is it's more than

Cliff Duvernois:

just putting a photo onto facebook.

Cliff Duvernois:

Oh, yeah.

Cliff Duvernois:

And say, here's a new cat by writing up that cat resume as

Cliff Duvernois:

you called it, right there.

Cliff Duvernois:

First off, people love your stories.

Cliff Duvernois:

because people are liking your posts, they're hearting your posts,

Cliff Duvernois:

they're commenting down below.

Cliff Duvernois:

They're doing everything, which from a social media marketing

Cliff Duvernois:

standpoint, that's what you want.

Cliff Duvernois:

You want to put content out there that people are gonna engage with, but these

Cliff Duvernois:

people seem to get really emotionally invested in what it is that you're doing.

Abby Engel:

Yeah.

Abby Engel:

I might be, because I think it's somewhat cats.

Abby Engel:

I do think, you know, you bring animals into something and you.

Abby Engel:

The animals.

Abby Engel:

Because who doesn't look a cute cat?

Abby Engel:

I mean, let's be honest.

Abby Engel:

Every time you see a cute animal on social media, you stop for a second

Abby Engel:

to look before you keep scrolling.

Abby Engel:

You gotta, but I also think it's just the story aspect that I bring to it.

Abby Engel:

I'm not just here's a cat.

Abby Engel:

They're fully vetted, they need a home.

Abby Engel:

I'll tell you everything about them, everything that I possibly can because

Abby Engel:

I want them, to find the perfect home.

Abby Engel:

And I want you to find the perfect cat.

Abby Engel:

And I feel like that's the best way to do it.

Abby Engel:

Sometimes I feel like I get down on myself, like I don't know what I'm doing.

Abby Engel:

I'm full imposter syndrome.

Abby Engel:

I guess I, and I get it a lot oh my gosh, how am I any better?

Abby Engel:

How, how can I be the person to decide whether or not these people get cats?

Abby Engel:

Like, how can I be this judgemental?

Abby Engel:

I hate judging people and I'm the one that judges applications

Abby Engel:

like, so I hate doing that , but.

Abby Engel:

. Other times

Abby Engel:

I look at, I read my own bio or I'll read a story that I wrote and I'll cry.

Abby Engel:

I'm reading my own writing and I'm tearing up and I'm like, oh my gosh, I guess

Abby Engel:

I am kind of good at this.

Abby Engel:

Sometimes , so sometimes I feel like everybody I feel like feels like that.

Abby Engel:

Like nobody knows what they're doing.

Abby Engel:

And I don't want anybody listening to this be like, oh my gosh, Abby

Abby Engel:

totally knows what she's doing cuz I'm winging this 100% 24 7.

Abby Engel:

But if you tell me something works, then I'm just gonna say, okay, well that works.

Abby Engel:

So I'm just gonna keep doing it and this works.

Abby Engel:

So I just keep doing.

Cliff Duvernois:

Well, I think for any either business or nonprofit out there,

Cliff Duvernois:

you kind of have to experiment to find out what it is that's really gonna

Cliff Duvernois:

resonate with your particular audience.

Cliff Duvernois:

Yep.

Abby Engel:

Oh, yeah.

Cliff Duvernois:

speaking of audience, let's talk about you and TikTok.

Cliff Duvernois:

Okay.

Cliff Duvernois:

Because that seems to be where you're really shining.

Cliff Duvernois:

Yeah.

Cliff Duvernois:

So how, how many people are following you now

Cliff Duvernois:

on,

Cliff Duvernois:

on

Abby Engel:

TikTok

Abby Engel:

You wanna get a live number?

Abby Engel:

Let me, uh, open up TikTok quick.

Abby Engel:So right now we,:Abby Engel:

So 219,800, is that what that is?

Cliff Duvernois:

200.

Cliff Duvernois:

19,800.

Abby Engel:

Yeah.

Abby Engel:

Two 19.8 K.

Abby Engel:

So

Abby Engel:

that's a lot.

Abby Engel:

Um, I'm at 5.4 million likes on TikTok as well.

Abby Engel:

And would you believe me if I told

Abby Engel:

you

Abby Engel:

I

Abby Engel:

have no idea what I'm.

Abby Engel:

That's

Abby Engel:

perfect.

Abby Engel:

I truly wing a lot of my TikTok, so I have worked with a couple companies now.

Abby Engel:

Um, but when I started TikTok, just like everybody else, I downloaded

Abby Engel:

during the pandemic, I was staying

Abby Engel:

home.

Abby Engel:

we were supposed to, but I have an animal rescue.

Abby Engel:

We can't just not go to the animal rescue for three weeks.

Abby Engel:

I was going in not every day, cuz I wasn't working full days, but

Abby Engel:

still to take care of the animals, to check on them, to see things.

Abby Engel:

And I'm bored.

Abby Engel:

I, the phone's not ringing.

Abby Engel:

I have no applications.

Abby Engel:

I can't do intakes, I can't do outtakes, I can't do anything.

Abby Engel:

So I just made a TikTok of the cat rescue because I'm sitting in the building for

Abby Engel:

by myself all day long doing nothing.

Abby Engel:

So I'll make

Abby Engel:

a TikTok and it.

Abby Engel:

People wanted to see my cats.

Abby Engel:

People had questions, people wanted to know more about me, so

Abby Engel:

I told my story, oh, this is how my parents started my cat rescue.

Abby Engel:

Oh, here's this cat.

Abby Engel:

This is, and I just explained our rescue, you know?

Abby Engel:

Oh, they're all fully vetted.

Abby Engel:

Oh yeah.

Abby Engel:

Like, no, we're a no kill shelter.

Abby Engel:

Oh, yeah.

Abby Engel:

They stay with us till they find a home.

Abby Engel:

Yeah, we have free room rooms.

Abby Engel:

They don't all have to stay in cages.

Abby Engel:

People loved it.

Abby Engel:

Sometimes I think some people come to my channel just for the cats.

Abby Engel:

Sometimes I think people come to my channel just for me, whatever

Abby Engel:

you come to my channel to.

Abby Engel:

I'm just glad you're there.

Cliff Duvernois:

So let's talk about some of the, the real

Cliff Duvernois:

tangible benefits of TikTok.

Cliff Duvernois:

Have you been able to raise money through TikTok?

Cliff Duvernois:

Yeah.

Cliff Duvernois:

Have you gained, uh, I don't wanna say notoriety, maybe,

Cliff Duvernois:

you know, you've garnered some, some real attention from people.

Cliff Duvernois:

Talk to us a little bit about that.

Abby Engel:

So there's good aspects of TikTok and there's bad aspects of

Abby Engel:

TikTok, so I kinda wanna talk about both.

Abby Engel:

The good is we've benefited from it in so many ways, not only from

Abby Engel:

being able to reach people globally, like I have followers from the other

Abby Engel:

side of the world who send, not even like monetary donations, but

Abby Engel:

they'll buy things off our Amazon wishlist and send them to the rescue.

Abby Engel:

So we're getting.

Abby Engel:

More donations than we ever have before from people all over the

Abby Engel:

world who have never heard of us or even know me personally.

Abby Engel:

They just wanna send my cats a cat, you know, a cat tree.

Abby Engel:

And we love that and

Abby Engel:

we

Abby Engel:

love to see it.

Abby Engel:

I feel like sometimes there's some people who aren't so nice too, see the internet.

Abby Engel:

Yeah.

Abby Engel:

And so that, I feel it gets hard to show up on TikTok for me, sometimes

Abby Engel:

I won't post for a little bit just because I'm a very empathetic person

Abby Engel:

and I don't think people realize that.

Abby Engel:

I do read the comments, so I'll see something.

Abby Engel:

You know, someone could be really great bringing, like it

Abby Engel:

brings in a lot of donations.

Abby Engel:

So many people from this one video brought,

Abby Engel:

but one bad comment, I don't wanna post for.

Abby Engel:

So even though it's benefiting my rescue and my cats are seeing success, it's

Abby Engel:

i'll, I've cried over comments probably this week alone, people will reach out.

Abby Engel:

They don't think I see it.

Abby Engel:

They don't, oh, she has 200 followers.

Abby Engel:

She doesn't see my dms.

Abby Engel:

I see the dms and they're not kind, and I don't answer most of

Abby Engel:

the, not kind ones, but I see 'em.

Abby Engel:

So it kind of, The two coins.

Abby Engel:

I have people from other sides of the world who are reaching

Abby Engel:

out, sending donations.

Abby Engel:

People who have lived left us in our will, in their wills.

Abby Engel:

We don't even know them, and they've left us in their wills.

Abby Engel:

I've had adopters find us on TikTok.

Abby Engel:

I've gotten to work with amazing brands that all of us use every single day.

Abby Engel:

I've made money myself, not only just for the karaoke, but people have paid me

Abby Engel:

for who

Abby Engel:

I am for.

Abby Engel:

And I've never a mil imagined that in a million years.

Abby Engel:

But then on the flip coin, I open my comments and people are calling

Abby Engel:

me names and saying, I did this in my video, so I'm a bad person, or

Abby Engel:

I didn't post, so I'm a bad person.

Abby Engel:

And so there's both of it.

Abby Engel:

, it's really helping the rescue, but sometimes it's really damaging

Abby Engel:

my

Abby Engel:

self-esteem and my

Abby Engel:

personal worth

Cliff Duvernois:

because a lot of who you are.

Cliff Duvernois:

Is wrapped up in this because you are literally sharing

Cliff Duvernois:

your

Cliff Duvernois:

story as

Cliff Duvernois:

you

Cliff Duvernois:

go.

Abby Engel:

Yeah.

Abby Engel:

I'm not a character.

Abby Engel:

I'm not an actor.

Abby Engel:

I'm not

Abby Engel:

a fake, I think a character.

Abby Engel:

I'm not a, well, I guess I shouldn't say a character in a book.

Abby Engel:

I'm not like a made up person that this company has put me

Abby Engel:

on to be their spokes model.

Abby Engel:

I'm the only employee at Pet Angel.

Abby Engel:

I'm the face of the place.

Abby Engel:

I am the employee of the place, and I'm also Akel, not Pet Angel.

Abby Engel:

I have other things I do in my life too, not.

Abby Engel:

Cat rescue related.

Abby Engel:

So it's really hard for me to like unravel the two sometimes.

Abby Engel:

So if someone gets really upset that I am not taking a cat from them, or I didn't,

Abby Engel:

I, their application was denied for some reason, they'll take it out on me.

Abby Engel:

And I take that personally.

Abby Engel:

So I've been trying to put up some boundaries a little bit on social media.

Abby Engel:

Um, like I don't always answer personal dms anymore.

Abby Engel:

Um, they have to be directed to like Pet Angels account

Abby Engel:

if they're pet Angel related.

Abby Engel:

Just to protect myself a little bit more.

Cliff Duvernois:

When you were talking before about these negative comments

Cliff Duvernois:

that were coming in and how it takes a little bit of an emotional toll

Cliff Duvernois:

and you're, you don't post for a week

Cliff Duvernois:

mm-hmm.

Cliff Duvernois:

, you know, you need to take a break.

Cliff Duvernois:

How do you overcome.

Cliff Duvernois:

That to get back onto the social media bandwagon, to get back onto TikTok, what,

Cliff Duvernois:

what is your thought process that that helps you to flip that switch to say,

Cliff Duvernois:

okay, yesterday I wasn't gonna do it, but today I'll do it.

Abby Engel:

usually

Abby Engel:

an idea

Abby Engel:

for a video.

Abby Engel:

If

Abby Engel:

I don't have an idea for a video, I'm probably not gonna show up if

Abby Engel:

I'm having one of those bad days.

Abby Engel:

Sometimes I'll be scrolling on TikTok at bed and I'll be like,

Abby Engel:

oh my gosh, I love this sound.

Abby Engel:

This is what I could do with it.

Abby Engel:

Save it.

Abby Engel:

And I make it the next day.

Abby Engel:

And then it just, I'm okay Again, there's no bad comments on that video.

Abby Engel:

I'm okay.

Abby Engel:

It, I think it depends on the comments though too.

Abby Engel:

If it was something really bad, if they've been continuing, I'm gonna probably

Abby Engel:

not post for a little bit because I want that person to kind of forget I

Abby Engel:

existed before I start posting again.

Abby Engel:

I do block people, but people don't care if they make a

Abby Engel:

second profile and find you.

Abby Engel:

There's hate watchers.

Abby Engel:

They count as a view, so thanks for the view, but sometimes I wish people

Abby Engel:

wouldn't leave comments that are mean.

Abby Engel:

If you don't say anything, if you don't have anything nice to

Abby Engel:

say, don't say anything at all.

Abby Engel:

Should be a rule still.

Cliff Duvernois:

so TikTok has actually had a lot more benefits.

Cliff Duvernois:

For the rescue.

Cliff Duvernois:

Yes.

Cliff Duvernois:

And there's definitely has been a benefit to, you know, for fair lack

Cliff Duvernois:

of a better term, for being fearless.

Abby Engel:

Yeah.

Abby Engel:

To

Abby Engel:

go

Cliff Duvernois:

TikTok, cuz not a lot of people would do that.

Abby Engel:

I don't know if I'm fearless because I do think the hate is pretty

Abby Engel:

hard sometimes and I do privately take it pretty hard, but, I still show up

Abby Engel:

because it's my job because no one else is gonna do it for the cats.

Abby Engel:

So if I don't like, we'll lose all of these followers.

Abby Engel:

We lose all of these donors and I feel like it's kind of riding

Abby Engel:

on me to, to keep 'em entertained so they'll keep helping us.

Abby Engel:

I think that it's like a give serve.

Abby Engel:

I give them the cat content, they give us donations,

Abby Engel:

but

Abby Engel:

it

Abby Engel:

works out.

Abby Engel:

There are some really great people.

Abby Engel:

I've met some people on TikTok that I wouldn't have known

Abby Engel:

otherwise, and now they're like, I've never met them in real life.

Abby Engel:

We just talk on social media because they've become great

Abby Engel:

supporters of our rescue.

Abby Engel:

I'm sure they're listening to this cuz they support us so much.

Abby Engel:

They'll listen to anything I post.

Abby Engel:

Anything that has to do with the cat rescue, they'll be there.

Abby Engel:

So I'm sure they, they're listening.

Abby Engel:

They're like, yeah.

Abby Engel:

Oh

Abby Engel:

my

Abby Engel:

god,

Abby Engel:

that's

Abby Engel:

me.

Abby Engel:

It is you.

Abby Engel:

Hi Stephanie

Cliff Duvernois:

me.

Cliff Duvernois:

Oh,

Abby Engel:

Oh, that's so wonderful.

Abby Engel:

Being able to create relationships media like that.

Abby Engel:

Yeah.

Abby Engel:

And I don't even know them.

Abby Engel:

They just love our rescue, love what we do, and they're there for us.

Abby Engel:

And I mean, we had a, I have two cats, their names Sonny and Bunny last

Abby Engel:

year.

Abby Engel:

They had

Abby Engel:

to have, they have.

Abby Engel:

I think

Abby Engel:

it's pronounced

Abby Engel:

periodontal disease.

Abby Engel:

And they had to have full dental work done, teeth pulled.

Abby Engel:

Bunny got most of his teeth pulled during the surgery and we found

Abby Engel:

out they had it and they needed the surgery pretty quickly.

Abby Engel:

And we did not have the money for two cats to get dental surgery at the same time.

Abby Engel:

And I made a TikTok about it and by the end of the day, I had enough money

Abby Engel:

for both of those cats to get their

Abby Engel:

dental surgery

Abby Engel:

plus

Abby Engel:

more.

Abby Engel:

So

Abby Engel:

I'm able to get things.

Abby Engel:

Never before were possible

Abby Engel:

because of TikTok.

Abby Engel:

Like Bunny and Sunny would've had to wait months before for us to raise enough

Abby Engel:

money for them to get that surgery, and I was able to schedule it the next day.

Abby Engel:

I don't really wanna talk about f I P a lot because it's really complex and

Abby Engel:

I definitely cry when I talk about it.

Abby Engel:

But f i p is a really bad fatal disease that is kind of coming up

Abby Engel:

in the cat rescue world right now.

Abby Engel:

If you're worrying about it for your animal, you don't need to.

Abby Engel:

It usually only happens when there's a lot of animals that are together.

Abby Engel:

It has to do with the feline coronavirus.

Abby Engel:

It's very complex.

Abby Engel:

You can look it up if you want.

Abby Engel:

It's called F i P but it hit our rescue two years ago.

Cliff Duvernois:

ago.

Cliff Duvernois:

Oh,

Abby Engel:

And we lost a couple cats to it.

Abby Engel:

A few of them are very dear to my heart.

Abby Engel:

My bottle feed babies, my, that eye bottle fed had 'em, um, I lost one

Abby Engel:

of them and two of them are now our office cats there, f i p survivors.

Abby Engel:

But because of TikTok, I believe those cats survived.

Abby Engel:

F i p.

Abby Engel:

because I wouldn't have been able to afford the medication.

Abby Engel:

It is so, so expensive.

Abby Engel:

We currently have a cat who has f i p, she's in foster care.

Abby Engel:

She is on the medication, but it's very expensive and I don't think we'd be able

Abby Engel:

to even do this medication and save their lives if I didn't have TikTok followers

Abby Engel:

who

Abby Engel:

are

Abby Engel:

giving

Abby Engel:

us

Abby Engel:

views, which is giving us donations.

Cliff Duvernois:

So I think it's safe to say that making that

Cliff Duvernois:

investment into creating these little short videos on TikTok,

Cliff Duvernois:

creating

Cliff Duvernois:

this

Cliff Duvernois:

content,

Cliff Duvernois:

sharing the

Cliff Duvernois:

story, has

Cliff Duvernois:

paid off

Cliff Duvernois:

for

Cliff Duvernois:

you in

Cliff Duvernois:

spades.

Abby Engel:

TikTok has saved cat's lives for sure, at my cat rescue, and

Abby Engel:

I don't think that people realize it.

Abby Engel:

Like, I don't think, when people watch my TikTok, they're like, oh,

Abby Engel:

I just, I'm making a difference.

Abby Engel:

But you are like, you truly are.

Abby Engel:

When people leave, like a comment that spikes the video

Abby Engel:

when people

Abby Engel:

like

Abby Engel:

the

Abby Engel:

video

Abby Engel:

that spikes the video,

Abby Engel:

like all

Abby Engel:

of

Abby Engel:

it's

Abby Engel:

helping.

Abby Engel:

I don't think yeah, just

Abby Engel:

watching

Abby Engel:

it, it helps.

Abby Engel:

I don't joke when I say like a dollar donation.

Abby Engel:

If you make $1 donation on Facebook, we get that whole donation from Facebook.

Abby Engel:

They don't take a portion of a donation made through there.

Abby Engel:

So that, or like PayPal or something like that, that $1 is making a huge

Abby Engel:

difference because you know, 50 people can make a $1 donation and that's $50.

Abby Engel:

So I don't think people realize like, yeah, you know, one view, one full,

Abby Engel:

watching a TikTok on one full video might give them 1 cent, but that's

Abby Engel:

5,000 people doing that at once.

Abby Engel:

That's.

Abby Engel:

Money in

Abby Engel:

an hour.

Abby Engel:

So it helps

Abby Engel:

and

Abby Engel:

everything

Abby Engel:

helps.

Abby Engel:

And I, I appreciate TikTok.

Abby Engel:

I really do.

Abby Engel:

I know I was talking trash on it.

Abby Engel:

Sometimes it really is hard sometimes to just show up on it every day,

Abby Engel:

but I'm finding ways to manage it.

Abby Engel:

One thing

Abby Engel:

I have

Abby Engel:

been doing

Abby Engel:

is Bulk making my tos so I don't have to show up on TikTok

Abby Engel:

every day to make a video.

Abby Engel:

I can just make four in one day and then I don't have to make a

Abby Engel:

video for three days, and that's

Abby Engel:

been helping me a lot.

Abby Engel:

Yes.

Abby Engel:

Don't have to get myself fully ready and show up on camera when I'm not feeling it.

Cliff Duvernois:

please.

Cliff Duvernois:

Certainly.

Cliff Duvernois:

Abby, for our audience, if anybody's listening to this and they want to

Cliff Duvernois:

connect with you, learn more about Pet angel adoption, maybe even find you on

Cliff Duvernois:

tikTok and leave you a nice comment,

Cliff Duvernois:

, Abby Engel: Yes, please.

Cliff Duvernois:

So I am Ace Engel, which is just a C E E N G E L on all social media platforms.

Cliff Duvernois:

And then Pet Angel adoption is just pet angel adoption on TikTok.

Cliff Duvernois:

It's just me.

Cliff Duvernois:

Pet Angel does not have their own TikTok.

Cliff Duvernois:

It's my TikTok.

Cliff Duvernois:

We are one , which is just the Ace angle.

Cliff Duvernois:

Um, and then on Facebook it's just Pet Angel, cat Adoption and Rescue.

Cliff Duvernois:

I don't use my personal Facebook for like cat stuff, so don't look me up on there.

Cliff Duvernois:

Just look up Pet Angel's account.

Cliff Duvernois:

I'm the one that answers everything on there.

Cliff Duvernois:

And for our audience, you can go to total michigan.com.

Cliff Duvernois:

Click on Abby's interview and get all the links that she

Cliff Duvernois:

shared with us today in the show.

Cliff Duvernois:

And please take a moment to donate to their great cause.

Cliff Duvernois:

If you are interested in having these stories sent directly to

Cliff Duvernois:

your inbox, head over to our website@totalmichigan.com slash join.

Cliff Duvernois:

Give us your email and we'll send you our top five interviews along with the

Cliff Duvernois:

powerful lessons that I've learned along the ways talking to these people that

Cliff Duvernois:

are doing really extraordinary things.

Cliff Duvernois:

You'll also get an invitation to join our private Facebook group, as well

Cliff Duvernois:

as Advanced notice of upcoming guests and great behind the scenes stories.

Cliff Duvernois:

Once again, that's total michigan.com/join, and I'll